NEW PRODUCT: TBLeague Amazon Warrior (Black/Brown version)

Well, she could benefit from another headsculpt I think. And I knew Diana would love it, haha. Classic tbleauge release in my book.

Annalise wrote: you want historical accuracy, then Phicen/TBL has never been that.

Well, you speak the truth here. Looking for historical accuracy/plausibility here is like complaining to a fast food company about their food not being healthy.  Works better with Poptoys and Coomodel.

And I might repeat myself again, but don't get any hopes up of seeing a dark skinned human character anytime soon from a Chinese company. They just want light skinned characters.
And if there is a black character presented one day, I would not recommend reading the comments on BBICN...

shazzdan wrote:... Hobbies aren't supposed to make you money. Hobbies and entertainment are what make life worth living. As soon as you try to make money from your hobby, it becomes a job.

Ha, beautifully said! I won't say anything against someone who collects unopened boxes, but this would take all the fun out of it for me personally.

And we want to see your kitbashed Xena tomorrow, you have 24 hours!

Diana wrote:Let me invite you into the mind of someone who LOVES these figures...

I don't care for historical accuracy. My teenage hero was Xena. 'nuff said.

Annalise wrote:Fine, simp label accepted. I am going to buy them both. If you want historical accuracy, then Phicen/TBL has never been that. They make the best hot girls in armour and I'm all in.

These fantasy warrior women are why I started buying 1/6 figures. So I accept partial blame for these repetitive boring releases. (You and me Diana!) I'm very happy they're not another Egyptian deity, and will look great alongside my 5 Spartans and various Sonjas, etc.

Hey, I am with you in spirit, honest.  I wasn't trying to cast any judgment or aspersions on people who enjoy this aesthetic because I'm one of them.  I don't care about accuracy one whit and warrior women are definitely a go-to.  Red Sonja will always be a buy for me lol and with Sonjaversal there can now even be orange, purple, robot and hell Sonja(!) if we want.

I loved the black, white, and gold 2020 Spartan releases and in a vacuum I'd love this one too, I'm just getting annoyed with TBLeague cheapskating on things.  So while I am absolutely here for hot warrior women, it's when I see the *same* hot warrior women over and over instead of new and different hot warrior women that I get a little disappointed.

Kallor8 wrote:I'm just getting annoyed with TBLeague cheapskating on things

100% agree with you there. The spartan contents of this set is the next step in a disturbing trend. Bare feet, no bracelets or armlets or thigh bands, few accessoires and we get a small ugly rock base instead. What's next, no helmet or weapons either?

Create some new elements, give us decent number of them and just raise the damned price if you must.

Annalise wrote:

Kallor8 wrote:I'm just getting annoyed with TBLeague cheapskating on things

100% agree with you there. The spartan contents of this set is the next step in a disturbing trend. Bare feet, no bracelets or armlets or thigh bands, few accessoires and we get a small ugly rock base instead. What's next, no helmet or weapons either?

Create some new elements, give us decent number of them and just raise the damned price if you must.

And make the base optional, to save on shipping costs.

Diana wrote:
Oooph! The comments on BBICN are not kind... Curious to see whether TBL will react to it with changes. *I hope not*

That’s one of the many things wrong with the internet. As long as people can “hide” behind usernames, common decency and courtesy go right out the window. While I may find these redundant, I’m not going to fault anyone for wanting them— it’s their money, they can spend it how they wish. Plus, attacking the manufacturer with vitriol isn’t exactly the way to go if one wants results. It happens A LOT over at The Freaks. I feel bad for any manufacturer rep who hangs out over there, as there is no shortage of personal attacks. (I am however, salty we haven’t gotten the mermaid up for PO though… Grrr!).

Ovy wrote:And we want to see your kitbashed Xena tomorrow, you have 24 hours!

Heh. I've actually thought about it a few times and started working on a design but can't think of a way to implement it that would satisfy me. Anything I tried would end up a disappointment. A well-executed commercial version of Xena is probably the only figure that I would buy without taking the cost into consideration.

shazzdan wrote:

Ovy wrote:And we want to see your kitbashed Xena tomorrow, you have 24 hours!

Heh. I've actually thought about it a few times and started working on a design but can't think of a way to implement it that would satisfy me. Anything I tried would end up a disappointment. A well-executed commercial version of Xena is probably the only figure that I would buy without taking the cost into consideration.

I know exactly what you mean.  And I could probably live with a costume approximation based on TBL parts, given Xena herself had some variations, but the headsculpt is the thing.  I can't believe it that AFAIK there has been no attempt at a collectibles quality Xena headsculpt (or an older Lawless to go with all the Spartaci).  The contemporaneous Xena figures were surprisingly good for what they were at the time, with one of the better (most recognizable) likenesses ever in cheap mass retail, but that is not the standard that we need.  Hoping, with you, for a "well-executed commercial version," but who would make it? HT is unlikely.  HH/HY or TBL have the proven skills for some components, but the former never makes women, and the latter (although its headsculpts have improved) hasn't even tried to make an actual actor likeness after disappointments back in their ER period like Bettie Page and Julie Newmar.

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote:Hoping, with you, for a "well-executed commercial version," but who would make it?  HT is unlikely.  HH/HY or TBL have the proven skills for some components, but the former never makes women, and the latter (although its headsculpts have improved) hasn't even tried to make an actual actor likeness after disappointments back in their ER period like Bettie Page and Julie Newmar.

HH & HY did make some female gladiator figures (at least two), right about the same time as the John Cena-headed gladiator. I don't know if either one was based on a specific woman.

TBLeague made Penny Robinson, Judy Robinson, and a Halle Berry. How good the first two were I can't tell, never having watched Lost in Space. Halle was so-so.

GubernatorFan wrote:

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote:Hoping, with you, for a "well-executed commercial version," but who would make it?  HT is unlikely.  HH/HY or TBL have the proven skills for some components, but the former never makes women, and the latter (although its headsculpts have improved) hasn't even tried to make an actual actor likeness after disappointments back in their ER period like Bettie Page and Julie Newmar.

HH & HY did make some female gladiator figures (at least two), right about the same time as the John Cena-headed gladiator. I don't know if either one was based on a specific woman.

TBLeague made Penny Robinson, Judy Robinson, and a Halle Berry. How good the first two were I can't tell, never having watched Lost in Space. Halle was so-so.

Quite rightly you remind me that HH/HY made a female figure, but it was the only just the one, not at least two, against their total male output.  Like the typical TBL figure, you could get her in black or red, otherwise identical.

As to TBL I was taking all of those into account when I mentioned "disappointments back in their ER period like Bettie Page and Julie Newmar."  There was also an Eartha Kitt.  Also males like Stan Lee.  Nobody as I recall liked any of them even by the standards of the time.  I believe that the consensus was that ER not TBL was responsible for the headsculpts, because that was something on the Licensing side, (The whole point to that joint venture was that TBL didn't know anything about licensing and ER did). The Lost in Space may actually even have been older unused Amok Time designs.  Subsequently you can see the learning curve when TBL took over their own sculpts, and they improved gradually, but without ever returning to try a living person likeness.

But none of that is important. You've... never.. watched.. Lost in Space???

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote:But none of that is important.  You've... never.. watched.. Lost in Space???  

LOL. Yes, I may be showing my age (or is it youth?) but I have indeed never watched Lost in Space. At least not this version -- was there a remake with Heather Graham or something? I may have seen that. There is a reason I don't have much nostalgia for older science fiction (partial exception -- Blake's Seven); and I suppose I have been spoiled by Star Wars (original trilogy).

Kallor8 wrote:I loved the black, white, and gold 2020 Spartan releases and in a vacuum I'd love this one too, I'm just getting annoyed with TBLeague cheapskating on things.  So while I am absolutely here for hot warrior women, it's when I see the *same* hot warrior women over and over instead of new and different hot warrior women that I get a little disappointed.

That pretty much sums up where I’m at, right down to my love for the Spartan Commanders. The black and golden Spartan Commanders were the first 1/6 figures I bought after a 15 year hiatus, and at the time, I expected TBL warrior women to dominate my collection. One year and several releases later, they’re still the only two 1/6 TBL warrior women I own.

I wish TBLeague could/would re-release/update some of their earlier figures that a lot of us missed. I mean, it’s their own creations and then three licenses (Coffin, Xenoscope, AHR Studios) that make up the bulk of their back catalogue. We’re not talking about Marvel, DC, and Star Wars here. It shouldn’t be that hard. In fact, the mermaid that Stryker and many others among us have been waiting for is a ARH Studios character (Sharleze).

GubernatorFan wrote:

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote:But none of that is important.  You've... never.. watched.. Lost in Space???  

LOL. Yes, I may be showing my age (or is it youth?) but I have indeed never watched Lost in Space. At least not this version -- was there a remake with Heather Graham or something? I may have seen that. There is a reason I don't have much nostalgia for older science fiction (partial exception -- Blake's Seven); and I suppose I have been spoiled by Star Wars (original trilogy).

I'm just kidding you, obviously, but the Holy Trinity of my early childhood was Batman ’66, Star Trek and Lost in Space.  People forget this now, but the big genre boom of the 1960’s was all about showing off the status symbol – people with their brand new colour TVs and all those shows that emphasized lots of bright, fast moving primary colors.  Which is why there were Batman ’66, Star Trek and Lost in Space, but also Bewitched, Green Hornet, Captain Nice, etc.  My dad transplanted us from Italy to North America, so he got the family something that didn't exist back in Italy, namely a color tv that brought me Batman, Star Trek and Lost in Space.  Fully with you on Blake's 7 BTW.

The first thing I saw on our first colour TV was Captain Scarlet.

shazzdan wrote:The first thing I saw on our first colour TV was Captain Scarlet.

Not Thunderbirds first? All that Supermarionation stuff was terrific, at least to my young eyes.

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote:I'm just kidding you, obviously, but the Holy Trinity of my early childhood was Batman ’66, Star Trek and Lost in Space.  People forget this now, but the big genre boom of the 1960’s was all about showing off the status symbol – people with their brand new colour TVs and all those shows that emphasized lots of bright, fast moving primary colors.  Which is why there were Batman ’66, Star Trek and Lost in Space, but also Bewitched, Green Hornet, Captain Nice, etc.  My dad transplanted us from Italy to North America, so he got the family something that didn't exist back in Italy, namely a color tv that brought me Batman, Star Trek and Lost in Space.  Fully with you on Blake's 7 BTW.

My dad transplanted us from the old country to the US at the start of the 90s; we had got our first color TV in the early 80s. While we did see Star Wars only in cinemas, we saw Blake's 7 and the Planet of the Apes series on TV. But there was relatively little exposure to the rest of sci fi (Westerns and contemporary movies, on the other hand, there were quite a few).

GubernatorFan wrote:

That said, real Amazons (i.e., Amazons as imagined by the Ancient Greeks) would have looked like this:

I was thinking along these lines...

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote:

shazzdan wrote:The first thing I saw on our first colour TV was Captain Scarlet.

Not Thunderbirds first?  All that Supermarionation stuff was terrific, at least to my young eyes.

There were only two channels in my area in the 70s so we didn't really get a choice what to watch. Captain Scarlet was on when I got up the morning after my dad brought the TV home so I watched it. I watched Thunderbirds when it was on, too, but CS was the very first thing I ever saw in colour.

Someday I will make the Scythian figure I've been dreaming about.... :')

But as others have said, yeah, of course this figure is not going to win anytihng for originality or historical...well, anything. However, it's interesting to see what they are doing with these smaller bust bodies. On that level, at least, I appreciate the change.  I also like the brown headsculpt, even if it does have that very recognisably (ie 'same-y') tbleague vibe. I would pick it up loose if such things weren't so insanely expensive these days.

Ovy wrote:And I might repeat myself again, but don't get any hopes up of seeing a dark skinned human character anytime soon from a Chinese company. They just want light skinned characters.
And if there is a black character presented one day, I would not recommend reading the comments on BBICN...

Waaaay back, early in the plastic skeleton-bodied days, they did manufacture an 'African' female base body with head sculpt. To make one to that earlier standard wouldn't be acceptable in a number of senses these days of course, but they have at least attempted it before. The M36 proves that they can produce a more realistic African skintone now, but I think the real stumbling block for them in producing a female African body type would be in crafting an accurate (or even appropriate) head sculpt from scratch.

I believe their last real attempt at a (female) African type body/set was the unreleased Eartha Kitt figure from a few years back (I don't think their Halle Berry figure counts at all - the skintone on that was really odd and the sculpt was a bit... insulting to Ms Berry, to my mind).



Cult TV Confessions: Captain Scarlet, Space:1999 (first series obviously), Blake's Seven  

Interesting...

For some reason, GianToy are asking a little more for these Amazons than for the New Spartans. Possibly because of the way the cost of living in general is skyrocketing. Possibly because of the newer body and the superior sculpts on the Amazons (it surely can't be because of the 'tons of extra accessories'). Or maybe they've just listed the prices the wrong way round.  

I've now concluded that I'd order the Brown Spartan in a shot if it had the Brown Amazon's sculpt and body, but as it is I'm becoming more and more inclined to wait for them both getting parted-out instead.

GeeWillikers wrote:Interesting...

For some reason, GianToy are asking a little more for these Amazons than for the New Spartans. Possibly because of the way the cost of living in general is skyrocketing. Possibly because of the newer body and the superior sculpts on the Amazons (it surely can't be because of the 'tons of extra accessories'). Or maybe they've just listed the prices the wrong way round.  

At Toy Square, which is my standard go-to,  the Spartan Army Commanders Black or Golden are USD$229.99 while the Soldier Amazons Black or Brown are USD$220.00, which seems marginally more logical.  Maybe GianToys do have it flipped around, or maybe it's some quirk of shipping costs or whatever -- maybe they have to give Jeff Bezos an extra $20 for anything called "Amazon."

They’re $189 at Big Bad Toy Store, so the additional shipping cost from the weight of the base and/or the dimensions of the box probably does have something to do with it. If I were to buy one from BBTS, I epuld have to pay 7.5% sales tax and the flat $4 shipping, so call it a round $207 vs $250 at Giantoy, but that doesn’t really work if you live outside the U.S. and don’t qualify for the flat rate shipping.

One thing that cracks me up about the uniforms…the Amazons could forge decorative form fitting armor, but they can’t be bothered to hem a skirt or cloak?!?

Xavion2004 wrote:They’re $189 at Big Bad Toy Store, so the additional shipping cost from the weight of the base and/or the dimensions of the box probably does have something to do with it.  If I were to buy one from BBTS, I epuld have to pay 7.5% sales tax and the flat $4 shipping, so call it a round $207 vs $250 at Giantoy, but that doesn’t really work if you live outside the U.S. and don’t qualify for the flat rate shipping.

The weird thing raised by GeeWillikers wasn't overall price, but why Giantoy Amazons cost more than Spartan Commanders.  At Toy Square the reverse is true.  Big Bad Toy Store adds to the confusion where they are cheaper overall (for US addresses) but their Amazons and Spartan Commanders are the same price.

GeeWillikers wrote:

Ovy wrote:And I might repeat myself again, but don't get any hopes up of seeing a dark skinned human character anytime soon from a Chinese company. They just want light skinned characters.
And if there is a black character presented one day, I would not recommend reading the comments on BBICN...

Waaaay back, early in the plastic skeleton-bodied days, they did manufacture an 'African' female base body with head sculpt. To make one to that earlier standard wouldn't be acceptable in a number of senses these days of course, but they have at least attempted it before. The M36 proves that they can produce a more realistic African skintone now, but I think the real stumbling block for them in producing a female African body type would be in crafting an accurate (or even appropriate) head sculpt from scratch.

I believe their last real attempt at a (female) African type body/set was the unreleased Eartha Kitt figure from a few years back (I don't think their Halle Berry figure counts at all - the skintone on that was really odd and the sculpt was a bit... insulting to Ms Berry, to my mind).

Thanks for the insight. Glad you still have hope, ha.
But yeah, that m36 body, I think I mentioned it somewhere before: This body, promoted as a basketball body (with magnetic basketball dribble hands and no regular grip hands) might be a one timer by tbleauge. Basketball is extremely popular in China. (Thanks to the YMCA) The amount of people watching basketball in China is higher than the population of the entire US. NBA players are joining the CBA. Companies invest billions. Stars promote sports products
So there is demand for a 1/6 body like that.

On the other hand, I have never seen a 1/6 female basketball player figure based on a real person yet. I think the chances are rather slim to get a seamless body produced that way. With everything else you mentioned, even slimmer.

[quote="GeeWillikers"]

Ovy wrote:And I might repeat myself again, but don't get any hopes up of seeing a dark skinned human character anytime soon from a Chinese company. They just want light skinned characters.
And if there is a black character presented one day, I would not recommend reading the comments on BBICN...

That racial calculus doesn't make sense anymore, even in strictly Asian market terms (quite apart from the entire North American and European demand). For TBL the mindset was probably formed in the early days when every figure was a discrete stand-alone, and they hadn't released that many of them. In that scenario they'd be thinking that "We release maybe 2 - 3 figures per year, and our Asian customers would not identify with a black woman as one of them." But nowdays every release tends to be a trio of variants, so it doesn't matter anymore whether the Asian customer directly identifies with the black woman so much. Actually making her one of the variants would increase the chances that people would buy not just one variant but all three making a team, squad or whatever. Especially that Exploitation classic, the three kick-ass white woman, black woman and Asian woman combo.

Moonbase Alpha Male wrote: ... nowdays every release tends to be a trio of variants, so it doesn't matter anymore whether the Asian customer directly identifies with the black woman so much. Actually making her one of the variants would increase the chances that people would buy not just one variant but all three making a team, squad or whatever.  Especially that Exploitation classic, the three kick-ass white woman, black woman and Asian woman combo.

Which makes total sense to me.

Quite aside from the fact that women of colour are a growing presence in all the media that lends itself to intrepretation in the action figure/collectible market (whether the Asian market likes it or not), it seems unbelievable that a 'classic' Pam Grier Gladiator and/or Grace Jones Warrior type design never seems to have even crossed anyone's mind.


Hope, meanwhile, springs eternal.

Unfortunately, I agree with you, Ovy. The M36 has the basketball explanation. There's a HUGE market for it. Just like those semi-seamless super tall bodies that were announced recently but then I think were cancelled again. Those were all based on basketball players. It's the only motivation they seem to have for making those additional skintones. It sucks, but I'm realistic about it. That's why we've spent so much time trying to find ways of colouring these bodies ourselves. I don't have time, patience, or inclination to wait around for stuff that likely won't ever materialise.

GianToy don't seem to be budging on those prices, which seem to be based on estimated weight (Spartan at 2.5kg, Amazon at 3kg).

Yet another reason to curse those non-optional bases.

I went with KGHobby this time, because they were 15 Euros cheaper each. Delivery was also no problem last time, with no import tax charged etc. so I'm hopeful it'll be like that again.