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Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash

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1Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Empty Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Sat May 07, 2022 12:47 pm

GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
HH Model and HaoYu Toys recently released their "Carthage Infantry" (HH18045) set. The figure is supposed to represent a Carthaginian infantryman, somewhat accurately recognizing that Carthaginian forces were largely mercenary and equipped with non-Carthaginian (Greek, Italian, Spanish) arms and armor. As usual, HH & HY spruced up the set, giving it additional items and messing up some of the details. I picked up some of the better pieces (including the head, which is a bit reminiscent of Eric Bana) and put together my own, using a seamless TBL body (M33 for the first figure, M32 for his colleague in a couple of the photos). Luckily, everything fit pretty well.

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci10

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci11

HH & HY based the set on professional historical reconstructions. As already noticed by Skippy, the immediate reference was an illustration by Steve Noon for Nic Fields' Osprey Warrior 150: Carthaginian Warrior 264-146 BC. On p. 44 (plate F), Noon has illustrated an Oscan mercenary in 202 BC, sporting items such as a Montefortino helmet (an excavated Samnite example is illustrated on p. 31) and a Samnite or Oscan triple-disc cuirass (as found in a tomb in Tunisia, illustrated on p. 35), Samnite or Oscan belt, Greek greaves, a large scutum-type body shield, and a sword and scabbard. Very similar figures, both as mercenaries in Carthaginian service and as Samnite warriors in Italy were already illustrated by Giuseppe Rava in Salimbeti and D'Amato's Osprey Elite 201: The Carthaginians 6th-2nd Century BC, p. 55 (plate H), and by Richard Hook in Sekunda and Northwood's Osprey Men-at-Arms 283: Early Roman Armies, p. 30 (plate F). HH & HY supplemented this with leather (or rather pleather) vambraces and sandals (or rather sandaled feet), and replaced the historical shorter throwing spears with a single extra-long and heavy spear. Needless to say, I did not pick up or employ these additions, and substituted some old Ignite spears that were about the right size and look. HH & HY otherwise did a great job recreating what was illustrated by Noon. Strangely, while the detail on the cuirass is very impressive, they managed to make a mistake here: on the chest plate the two discs should have a stylized flower-like ornamentation, and the top part should not be decorated with the same necklace-motif as the goddess' head at the bottom. The back plate, the top two discs are correct, but where the bottom disc appears, there should be another representation of the goddess' head (there exist other examples of such cuirasses that do have three plain discs); the actual artifact is shown more fully in Sekunda and Northwood, p. 39. The belt ought to be made mostly of leather, but HH & HY's choice of soft metal that can be opened or closed easily was inspired. The HH & HY shield is quite a lot smaller (and especially shorter) than it ought to be.

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci12

I bought enough pieces to outfit two Samnite/Oscan warriors, putting the first set on an M33 and the second set on a taller M32.

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci13

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci14

Here are a couple more looks at some of the equipment.

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci15

Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash Hhhyci16

Overall, I'm very happy with the set (even if I only picked up a bunch of parted out pieces) and wish that HH & HY would continue putting these out, but hopefully with better attention to details: it is one thing to add additional pieces that can be removed to achieve a more historically accurate look (like the vambraces), it is another to get "creative" with actual artifacts that you are supposedly replicating.

Since the look, although quite historical, is relatively unfamiliar, I used it for guards in my Lady of the Lake fantasy thread.

As always, what do you think?

#hh #haoyu #hy #carthage #italy #ancient #historical #male #custom #kitbash


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Randam Hajile

Randam Hajile
Nice work reviewing the pieces and assembling your own historical versions. Your two mercenaries look great. Rome should be careful, they seem dangerous... Wink

GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
Randam Hajile wrote:Nice work reviewing the pieces and assembling your own historical versions. Your two mercenaries look great. Rome should be careful, they seem dangerous... Wink  
Thank you very much, Ralf. Glad you liked them. Well... they taught Rome a thing or two, although they got conquered in the process. Then, in 89 BC, they got Roman citizenship (for all Italians!) for their troubles...


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shazzdan

shazzdan
I love it. You've definitely achieved the right look. The only problem isn't your fault but the breastplate. It is too wide, which hinders the arms from freely moving in front of the body. The real ones were narrower across the chest. Also, a layer of gold leaf paint might help to make the bronze pop.

It might be worth trying to heat up the greaves to make them fit more closely around the ankles

The backdrop should probably be of a building that was intact and functional rather than the ruin we see today.


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GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
shazzdan wrote:I love it. You've definitely achieved the right look. The only problem isn't your fault but the breastplate. It is too wide, which hinders the arms from freely moving in front of the body. The real ones were narrower across the chest. Also, a layer of gold leaf paint might help to make the bronze pop.

It might be worth trying to heat up the greaves to make them fit more closely around the ankles

The backdrop should probably be of a building that was intact and functional rather than the ruin we see today.
Thank you very much! You know your stuff, so this is doubly appreciated.

I agree on all the visual-related comments. The armor is indeed rather on the big side, although these apparently came in a variety of sizes. Another factor may be the size of the body on which it is displayed. It looked horrible on M30 (so much so I'm not showing any photos), ok on M33, better on M32. It might work better yet on M34, if I stuff one of those in there (but would the tunic fit? -- haven't tried).

The greaves are metal, so quite a lot of heating might be advisable. They do look too bulky to me, but I don't want to squeeze the TPE flesh of the seamless bodies inside, so I don't mind them being as they are. There are more close-fitting greaves out there, and my favorites are TBLeague's "Egyptian" ones -- unfortunately, the Egyptian-themed motif renders them useless in anything other than fantasy figures (which is why I gave them to my Atlantian mercenaries in the Lady of the Lake thread).

The same thing occurred to me about the building... then I thought, maybe they are at the site of a building they (or their enemies) already destroyed (some time earlier). Smile Give me credit for using a Greek temple in Italy. And I would have to look for a historical reconstruction of sufficiently good resolution (and sufficiently appropriate aspect, perspective, no distractions). Maybe one day...


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Ephiane

Ephiane
Thanks for showing. I really love these Guys. What a great lesson in acient history. They made the soldiers exactly like the historycal reference.

Stryker2011

Stryker2011
Founding Father
Nicely done. As usual your attention to historical accuracy paid off.


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Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash C8485110

Ovy

Ovy
Thanks for another history lesson accompanied by accurate figures!

Can the front and backpalte be swapped? This way you could make a blanko soldier and a two head soldier.

I have some really shiny golden metal greaves I cheaply got some time ago. They look very similar in form, but shiny metal in texture. I might look for them. For greaves, Worbla would be really great, as they can be formed directly onto the body. ( like that breastplate of my Southern warrior)
But then again these look great already.

Maybe these are post apocalyptic soldiers staning in front of an antique ruin.

GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
Ephiane wrote:Thanks for showing. I really love these Guys. What a great lesson in acient history. They made the soldiers exactly like the historycal reference.

I'm glad you liked them and didn't mind my teaching (preaching?). Smile They got pretty close, with relatively small goof ups, and I think I was able to fix most of them. Of course, there is almost always room for improvement.

Stryker2011 wrote:Nicely done. As usual your attention to historical accuracy paid off.

Thank you very much, Mark!

Ovy wrote:Thanks for another history lesson accompanied by accurate figures!

Can the front and backpalte be swapped? This way you could make a blanko soldier and a two head soldier.

I have some really shiny golden metal greaves I cheaply got some time ago. They look very similar in form, but shiny metal in texture. I might look for them. For greaves, Worbla would be really great, as they can be formed directly onto the body. ( like that breastplate of my Southern warrior)
But then again these look great already.

Maybe these are post apocalyptic soldiers staning in front of an antique ruin.

Thank you, glad you liked it. Yes, it might be possible to swap the plates -- or even simply put them on the other way. There were some relatively plain three disc designs, so that would look ok. Is Worbla a little flexible when it dries/cures? Because that would be ideal for greaves. I like TBLeague's relatively soft plastic greaves for that reason. Hmmm, a post-apocalyptic world that has reverted to the Iron Age... which is not too different from some of what you have been working on. Smile


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Ovy

Ovy
Yeah Worbla is still very flexible. It's made for armors of 1:1 people who like to bash each other with silicone swords. So if you make greaves that not only cover the shin but the back of the leg, they could be 'clipped' on and off even.

And yeah I really need to make some overview thread or something for my worlds, there seems to be some confusion.

GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
Ovy wrote:Yeah Worbla is still very flexible. It's made for armors of 1:1 people who like to bash each other with silicone swords. So if you make greaves that not only cover the shin but the back of the leg, they could be 'clipped' on and off even.

And yeah I really need to make some overview thread or something for my worlds, there seems to be some confusion.

Ah, but confusion and mystery often go hand in hand. Of course, more insight into your hauntingly beautiful world(s) is always welcome.

Thank you for the additional information. Between this and your Worbla creations, it is high time I gave it a try, rather than just admiring from afar.


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Theboo-bomb

Theboo-bomb
Overall it's a pretty cool set of something that is probably super obscure in 1/6, the inaccuracies I guess can be "forgiven" or if you are like me then you can ignore them entirely cause I wouldn't have known if you hadn't written about them. Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash 1f601


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GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
Theboo-bomb wrote:Overall it's a pretty cool set of something that is probably super obscure in 1/6, the inaccuracies I guess can be "forgiven"  or if you are like me then you can ignore them entirely cause I wouldn't have known if you hadn't written about them.  Oscan / Samnite Hoplite custom / kitbash 1f601
Thanks, I thought it had a lot of potential, too. It is quite good, which makes the few oversights (or poor choices) all the more regrettable, perhaps. Luckily, some of this can be accommodated by recourse to variety of designs, even if the copy of the specific source is not quite accurate. Smile


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