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An online community to discuss and share news about sixth-scale figures, with an emphasis on either custom or commercial articulated figures.


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I can't paint

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1I can't paint Empty I can't paint Fri Apr 12, 2024 1:21 pm

Visisonor

Visisonor
So I've been trying to paint a head for ages.
I can't paint Cnr_7429

I had some moderate success with weapons - blacks, greys, metallic colors. Here at least imperfect application can be handwaved as weathering. Still, sword blades look uneven. And I've cheated, in some sense - my better results were achieved with airbrush paints (Vallejo Air).

Which segues to the next point: thinning. All the tutorials always stress that paints should be thinned. Okay, makes sense, otherwise they are thick as lava and cover the surface with uneven blotches. But when I add water, the paint behaves like dirty water, not actually sticking to the surface and pooling in deeper areas.
Add too little water, it's lava. Add a bit more, it's too liquid. There is no in between.
Well, maybe sometimes. One time out of ten. So I was able to apply one later of paint several times in my life. But not even two, because do the math.

Oh, and this was for darker colors, which may look like tanned skin if you squint hard enough. I want something lighter, but all lighter colors have this powdery texture that never lays evenly, always in streaks, especially if it is thinned even slightly. I guess the proper word for it is "chalky": if you remember wiping chalk from whiteboards with wet cloth, that's exactly how it feels (oh how I hated that back in the day...).

I mean, just look at it:
I can't paint Cnr_7430

Speaking of colors, I have this,
I can't paint Face-skin-tones-70125-vallejo-figure-set

and it's useless. Maybe some colors work for scene details - but not for skintones. They are either too yellow or too orange, or too pink for Keeanu or Cara, and mixing with anything lighter (including white) results in chalkiness described above. I've tried Citadel, and they may be better unthinned (not as lava-like), but become too liquid much quicker. Tutorials say the desired color can be achieved by blending layers of lighter paints on top of darker, or vice versa, but I can't paint more than one layer. They all look like the owl to me now
I can't paint D6d

So I just don't know what to do with it. I get that learning something isn't supposed to yield satisfactory results right away. But I've been trying for years. Not continuously every single day though, it's more like a week or two then break for 6 months (otherwise I'd start throwing paint bottles at people and slowly burn brushes with a manical grin on my face). And I don't see how to adjust what I'm doing to do it better because there is no consistency or direction. It's like playing dice with a black cat in a dark aquarium, and the cat isn't even there (or pick any other metaphor about futility).

Maybe I should try an airbrush, but with my skills I expect it to get clogged even before I load anything into it, or it'll spray everything around save for the model, or explode in my hands.
It's probably moot anyway, there are already a few John Wick figures to choose from, the one from Aton Custom will likely come out before I paint more than one layer.

Anyway, this is not really a question, just stating that there are things not accessible to me. Sorry for the long rant.

2I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Fri Apr 12, 2024 3:02 pm

MeMyself&I

MeMyself&I
First things first: take a deep breath!


I understand your frustration and, believe me, I have thrown the head sculpts I have worked on. Maybe not at someone, but definitely across the room into the wall.

That said, it took me hours and hours and hours of testing and failure to find what worked for what I do. I do use an air brush, and there is a learning curve, but again, trial and mostly error. (Pro tip on air brushes: You get what you pay for in all aspects with it.)

I also use Vallejo and while I think they’re generally incredible, there are colors that require some work to get the most out of. White is at the top of that list. Yellow also fights back. Black is overwhelming if used improperly. BUT they have a HUGE range of colors, far beyond what you show above, so you can mix/match till your heart's content.

Here is what I suggest (they are only suggestions and are meant to encourage!):

1.) Again, just a deep breath as I can tell you’re frustrated. Don’t go into it with the mindset of failure as you’ll be guaranteed to fail. I’m sure you know that though. This hobby is supposed to be fun and frustration sucks that away really fast.

2.) Study your reference and see what the base colors are, and then compare them to the whole line Vallejo offers. You may need 5 colors to get one single tone.

3.)Then buy a few packs of white plastic spoons. They’re similar to the plastic that is used in head sculpts and miniatures. Cheap and if you mess up they are not a ruined project, just a $0.001 spoon. You’ll get a lot of work done and practice this way (I have 100 different spoons I have tested on myself for my painting).

4.) Give ample time to dry between layers. Vallejo likes, in my experience, to peal up if not left to dry long enough. A heat gun and 15-20 minutes works nicely.

5.) If not already, seriously watch as much YouTube from Warhammer mini painters as possible. They are the best of the best and more than happy to talk about this very thing and demonstrate. They show everything from airbrush to brush painting, and cover it often. Some even offer deep dive tutorials on how to layer and do skin tones, Squidmarminiatures being an excellent one.

I hope that helps and that you can make the breakthrough! Everyone will have different styles and tips, so finding what works for you is key.

3I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Fri Apr 12, 2024 7:37 pm

skywalkersaga

skywalkersaga
Sorry for your frustration, I do feel your pain at times. Painting in general is hard , let alone on 3D surfaces. I think you could try experimenting with mixing colours on the palette. Other than primers, I don’t think I’ve ever used Vallejo straight from the container, I always mix to get the colours I want. Also, making sure you are using the right type of brush for the effect you want is important, though requires experimenting as well. And regarding the thinning … how are you going about this? Are you mixing the water on the palette directly before applying or are you mixing with water in a bottle? This might affect the application and final result.


_________________
"The happy ending of the fairy tale, the myth, and the divine comedy of the soul, is to be read,
not as a contradiction, but as a transcendence of the universal tragedy of man."

Ignoring current 'official' Star Wars content for my own sanity.

4I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Fri Apr 12, 2024 8:33 pm

GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
It can be frustrating indeed. My biggest annoyance is getting an even white or very light color, as acrylics are somewhat translucent even when not particularly diluted. But that is not so much an issue with painting heads. I have followed some youtube tutorials and some advice offered in this forum, by Mark (Stryker2011 = Stryker2012) included, especially a dark-to-light technique, using Vallejo acrylics and no airbrush. One thing you want is a good primer (Vallejo makes them in black and grey and maybe other colors) as the bottom layer. Then you apply a bunch more layers, going from darker to lighter colors. Each layer should be slightly translucent (the consistency of milk, as one tutorial put it). You may need 2 or 3 applications of the top layer's color so it doesn't look messy. And then you need matte varnish (I actually mix in a little bit of Liquitex super matte medium, as the Vallejo matte varnish is not all that matte). Eyes should not be true white (I mix Vallejo off-white and ivory), and with a little bit of diluted beige/red at the corners and along the bottom edge. And, of course, glossed. Patience and perseverance are the key. It's still a challenge every time I try, but I'm not scared of the process anymore.
Here's my early tutorial, see especially Part III and its follow up:
https://onesixthfigures.forumotion.com/t3922-repainting-head-sculpts-to-match-body-updated-with-part-iii


_________________
I'll be back!
https://onesixthfigures.forumotion.com

5I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Fri Apr 12, 2024 10:39 pm

Visisonor

Visisonor
Thanks everyone for advices and encouragement!

MeMyself&I wrote:I have thrown the head sculpts I have worked on
Yeah, I've done that too - not at living beings, this was a hyperbole.

I've seen plastic spoons as a testbed for airbrushing metallic colors, didn't connect the dots that the same spoons can be used for experiments with skintones. I'll try it the next time I get back to painting, if ever.

I know many like and enjoy the process itself (which is quite understandable in general, and one of the reasons I like Kerbal Space Program, for example).
But for me painting was never something I wanted to do, it was rather a means to an end - which is to have a figure on a shelf (actually, the figure can then be used for photos, and photos are needed to illustrate stories, so the distinction between "the means" and "the end" is quite blurry).
Anyway if the end can be achieved differently, I'd rather go for it. And after wasting so much time on futile experiments with even more time inevitable in the future, spending a few hundred bucks on a headsculpt I want does not seem like a bad idea. After all, time is limited and unreplenishable.

If it seems like I've given up, I won't argue with that conclusion.

skywalkersaga wrote:And regarding the thinning … how are you going about this?
I squeeze a drop of blood paint (one or more drops for any paint in the mix) to the palette, then add tears a drop (or more) of water, then mix it all with a plastic stick.

GubernatorFan wrote:One thing you want is a good primer

Admittedly, I didn't use any primer for the heads in my original post. I've always assumed primer was needed if paints didn't stick to the surface in question - which was the case with the green and blue headsculpts I've painted earlier (red being a factory-made Mezco head). But here paint adheres quite well, to the point that it's hard to remove.

As for the eyes, I've read about eyes not being exactly white etc. This, however, is an endgame - and I can't even place my pieces on the board.

6I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Sat Apr 13, 2024 5:42 am

skywalkersaga

skywalkersaga
It’s ok if painting isn’t your thing. Not everyone in the hobby has the same skills or interest in developing the same skills. For instance, some people get really into the technical side  of toy photography and splurge on the most expensive equipment. I do like to do photoshoots, but this isn’t the area I’m personally most interested in spending my time, energy and limited funds on. If I get halfway decent shots, that’s enough for me.

With the painting, it’s likewise not gonna be everyone’s forte or cup of tea. I’m perhaps at an advantage as I’ve had formal art training and a lot of practice painting 2D art in the past (in acrylic, oils, watercolour, etc), so it comes as second nature to me. And even then, I still struggle at times.

If you have a specific vision for a figure and you can’t achieve it yourself, there’s no shame in commissioning a custom artist to paint it for you. It’s just something you have to be picky and choosy about, since it can be expensive and a long wait time. But professional results can be well worth it, especially if doing photoshoots is more your main aim.

7I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Mon Apr 15, 2024 7:56 am

Urushi

Urushi
@Gubernator gave some pretty good tips above.

There are some very useful tutorials on Youtube for painting without an airbrush, with very thinned layers of Vallejo. The crucial point is patience. Painting wash, sponge, painting wash, sponge, etc... I personally would begin with a lighter primer though. Flesh or white, if you don't want your flesh tones to end up greyish and dull.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMC5Tdv8HUE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-S5fQB1-aU

8I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Mon Apr 15, 2024 2:58 pm

skywalkersaga

skywalkersaga
Thanks for those videos, Urushi.

Patience is definitely key, especially with all the layers.


_________________
"The happy ending of the fairy tale, the myth, and the divine comedy of the soul, is to be read,
not as a contradiction, but as a transcendence of the universal tragedy of man."

Ignoring current 'official' Star Wars content for my own sanity.

9I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Mon Apr 15, 2024 6:47 pm

GubernatorFan

GubernatorFan
Founding Father
Thanks for the links, Urushi. I've seen one of them, the other maybe not, and one finds additional options on YouTube. I started out with a video tutorial much older than that, but don't have it handy to share.


_________________
I'll be back!
https://onesixthfigures.forumotion.com

10I can't paint Empty Re: I can't paint Fri Apr 19, 2024 12:41 pm

Urushi

Urushi
I just came across this series of videos that show the whole process in great detail from start to finish. No airbrush involved and the result is pretty decent imo.

Painting Captain Kirk head

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