1/6th scale Horses, general discussion

Hallo members, I am new for this forum. I have been building scale wagons and carts for over 50 years in the 1/8 scale and the 1/6 scale sizes. Since short I have seen the model horses of the brand Mr.Z from China ( or Korea?). A Hannoverian Horse measures 170 cm. or 17 hands. The sizes for a 1/8 horse should be 32 x 28 x 8 cm. - the sizes for a 1/6 horse should be 43 x 37 x 11 cm. Mr.Z horses are in the sizes of 37 x 33 x 11 cm. So they are to small for 1/6 - in fact they are made in the 1/7th scale! Did anyone of you notice that before? - I should like to make contact with the manufacturer of these horses than the models on itself are O.K. - does anyone has this information. Looking forward for your reply.
have a good day and stay healthy. Frits.nl

Frits.nl wrote:Hallo members, I am new for this forum. I have been building scale wagons and carts for over 50 years in the 1/8 scale and the 1/6 scale sizes. Since short I have seen the model horses of the brand Mr.Z from China ( or Korea?). A Hannoverian Horse measures 170 cm. or 17 hands. The sizes for a 1/8 horse should be 32 x 28 x 8 cm. - the sizes for a 1/6 horse should be 43 x 37 x 11 cm. Mr.Z horses are in the sizes of 37 x 33 x 11 cm. So they are to small for 1/6 - in fact they are made in the 1/7th scale! Did anyone of you notice that before? - I should like to make contact with the manufacturer of these horses than the models on itself are O.K. - does anyone has this information. Looking forward for your reply.
have a good day and stay healthy. Frits.nl

Hello Frits and welcome. I moved your thread to the General Talk section since it addresses figures that purport to be in sixth scale, even if imperfectly so. Thanks for the analysis and numbers. Mr Z's and others' horses have been subject to repeated discussion on the forum. The internal search engine is not very helpful, but you can Google "horse" alongside onesixthfigures.forumotion.com and should be able to come across the respective topics and posts. I believe some of the issues that have been pointed out were indeed about the size of some models. I suppose a slightly undersized horse could be said to not be fully grown, but I wouldn't know about the proportions. I do not know about the manufacturer's contact information, but I would imagine some of this might be on purpose, to control the size and weight of the item for financial reasons. But I will let others, who know more about horses in real life and in scale figures expand on this. It is also unclear to what extent they would revisit their older products.

I only know that the MrZ hanoverian horse is indeed too small, which is a shame for a otherwise pretty model. Might be the reason it hasn't sold out on most sites yet..

Would like to see a 1/6 scale wagon you built.

I dug up my thread on the Hanoverian horse. It is here:
https://onesixthfigures.forumotion.com/t1766-mr-z-hanoverian-horse-in-hand

Yeah, the Hanoverian was a big disappointment for me — the rider’s ankles should be at about the bottom of the horse’s belly at the most — shouldn’t have to lift his feet out of stirrups to give the gentle “ribbing” needed to get the horse moving.

If the so-called 'Hanoverian' horses are too small for Frits' purposes, perhaps he might be interested in the Mr. Z Thoroughbred instead?


https://www.space-figuren.de/advanced_search_result.php?categories_id=&inc_subcat=1&keywords=mr+z+thoroughbred

Stryker2011 wrote:Yeah, the Hanoverian was a big disappointment for me — the rider’s ankles should be at about the bottom of the horse’s belly at the most — shouldn’t have to lift his feet out of stirrups to give the gentle “ribbing” needed to get the horse moving.

Two things -- the figures in my photos weren't using a saddle and the level of the rider's ankle vis-a-vis the bottom of the horse's belly varies depending on the photo and the rider's position on top of the horse -- I changed the example photo (all are of course still in the original thread) -- is this better?

Many thanks GubernatorFan for you quick reply on my querrie. If we look at your picture of the standing girl and sitting male on the horse you will notice the feet of the man comes to low. The Hannoverian Horse has a height at the withers ( that is the point where the neck line meet the back line ) all equine animals, horses, mules, cobs, ponies,shetlands and farabellas are in size indicated with the length of the line from the top of the withers to the ground. For every breed you can find the correct size on the internet. For a Hannoverian it is between 160 cm ( 5ft and 3 inch) and 170 cm ( 5 ft and 7 inch ). Going out from the fact that the figures are in the 1/6 scale the girl can be 160 cm to 170 cm. high. Which means the top of the girl should be as high as the withers of the horse. In the picture the withers however is indicated by the fist of the rider which is much lower. So our conclusion must be the horse is ( far ) too small for a 1/6 scale. In the years I have adopted a feeling for size relations. This rider is not sitting on a horse he sits on a pony! I now wonder how are these models made by Mr.Z. There are three possibilities. With very expensive steel moulds with contra moulds as used with plastic building kits, or cast in a rubber mould ( like I did twenty years ago for 1/8 scale horses ) or the brand new way with 3-D machines. The last option might be time consuming however the maches become every year faster, they work 24 hours a day and large plants have hundreds of these machines working. Could it be that Mr.Z can not make realy 1/6 scale horses because the 3-D machines are too small? If so I have a solution for that. Make the horse head seperate. Doing so one can make several heads in different poses. Straight forward, turned to the left, turned to the right, looking up or looking down. With my casted 1/8 horses I had even the ears made seperate, so one can paste them in any position.
Imaging if you have a 1/6 scale model of a Royal Mail Coach you can put four different looking horses for it. First I need to come in contact with the maker of these horses. AliExpress, Google, Amazon and Ebay (= Amazon!) does not allow us to find the cheapest solution and offers CROOKS!
After hours of opening and closing websites I managed to break the wall and saw the Hannover Horse come by for the price of 57 pounds!  Frits.nl

Frits -- your own model horses sound wonderful! I love your solution for the head and ears, that is amazing! : )

As for the 'Hanoverian' model -- this particular model horse is indeed under-sized for the supposed breed, though it could pass as a large pony or small 'generic' horse. Just to clarify, though, Mr. Z is certainly capable of making larger horse models... please search on ebay or google for 'Mr. Z Shire Horse' and 'Mr. Z Thoroughbred', and you will find some models that are more suitably sized for 1/6 scale male riders. There is also a Mr.Z Akhal-Teke model available, which is larger than the faux-'Hanoverian'. There was a previous model called the 'Yli' or 'Ili' horse that was also much taller (but it is now unfortunately sold out). I think it is highly likely that with the 'Hanoverian', Mr. Z simply made an unfortunate mistake with the size, because they are not horse experts and this was one of their earlier models. But they seem to have learned since then, and have put out several models that are taller.

Mr.Z Shire horse:



Available here: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-6-Mr-Z-Resin-Statue-Animal-Series-20-Shire-Horse-In-Stock-Large-Size-Model-/173707041544


Mr.Z Thoroughbred:



Available here: https://www.space-figuren.de/advanced_search_result.php?categories_id=&inc_subcat=1&keywords=mr+z+thoroughbred


Mr.Z Akhal-Teke:



Available here: https://www.space-figuren.de/advanced_search_result.php?categories_id=&inc_subcat=1&keywords=mr+z+akhal+teke


A while ago I managed to contact an artist who is associated with Mr. Z (making the corgi dogs), and they mentioned that the resin horses are cast from molds. Hope this helps to clarify some information for you! : )

thank you Skywalker for your info. With 1/6th scale models of vehicles only standing horse models or pulling or walking horses can be used. Wild jumping sorts, sorry to say,is more for girls. I will be checking the Thoroughbred and the Akhal-Teke like you said. Frits.nl

Thank you for the detailed information, Frits.nl. It makes even more sense now. The female figure is a petite (S25B) so that is indeed one short horse. At the time it came out there was some discussion that other horses were being made too large, I guess this one went to the other extreme. There has been some inconsistency with Mr Z horses: I recall vaguely other models came out larger than they should have been, though this is obviously not the case here.

Useful compilation of options, Sky, thanks!

Frits.nl wrote:thank you Skywalker for your info. With 1/6th scale models of vehicles only standing horse models or pulling or walking horses can be used. Wild jumping sorts, sorry to say,is more for girls. I will be checking the Thoroughbred and the Akhal-Teke like you said. Frits.nl

You're welcome, Frits!

I completely understand about the need for the wagon-pulling or driving horses to be in a more static pose for this scale. I included the Shire horse model simply to demonstrate Mr. Z's capability to make larger models. : )

I'm not sure what you mean by the horses with movement being 'for girls' -- do you mean female model horse collectors are more likely to purchase those? I myself used to collect Traditional (1/9th scale) Breyer horse models many years ago, so I understand there's a market for that there. But even then, I still tended to prefer models that were not *too* 'animated' as I liked them to be somewhat versatile. All that being said, a beautiful action pose can make a lovely centerpiece or statue, from an artistic standpoint. And from an action figure collecting perspective, they can be very useful for creating a dynamic diorama scene.

Hopefully the Thoroughbred or Akhal-Teke might be useful for you. And perhaps Mr.Z will release additional model horses soon. : )

Welcome Frits ! This is a Mongolian Horse Mr. Z made. The Pose must be nice for the project You want to make. Can´t wait to see Your finish Bash.

Thanks, Ephiane. I always love that photoshoot, just beautiful!


And I just happened to come across some images of the Akhal-Teke in-hand. These are from Jean Ross' Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/Jean-Ross-Studio-Custom-Model-Horses-Saddles-and-Tack-587857378024544/photos/pcb.2304236819719916/2304236309719967

Here it is with a western saddle:





And here it is with a rider:




Looks absolutely awesome to me! In fact, I'm somewhat regretting that I didn't PO the golden version. ;p But my red bay version is supposed to ship soon, and I'm looking forward to it much more now.


And here is a comparison of heights (from behind) -- from left to right: Mr.Z Ili horse; Mr.Z Akhal-Teke; Mr.Z Hanoverian:



Seems like they finally found a 'happy medium'?



And here's a height comparison (also from Jean Ross' Facebook page) of the Mr.Z Hanoverian and the Mr.Z Arabian:



The Arabian model turned out a bit better than I'd expected. I think the atrocious manes in the promo pics did not do it any favours. But from this pic, it looks pretty good, and seems to have a bit more realism than I'd thought it would. That's only based on this one pic though, will have to see more...

Aww man, that Akhal-Teke looks awesome with the Western saddle — I POd the dark brown to go with the dark brown version of two other horses so I could (hopefully) get one set of western tack to be used with all three to change up the horse as one animal.

Stryker2011 wrote:Aww man, that Akhal-Teke looks awesome with the Western saddle — I POd the dark brown to go with the dark brown version of two other horses so I could (hopefully) get one set of western tack to be used with all three to change up the horse as one animal.

Yeah, I think this Akhal-Teke is very much an 'under saddle' model, and will look best fully tacked up and with a rider. The set of the mouth means it needs to be wearing a bridle and bit, and the pose seems to suggest someone is pulling it up by the reins.  Since I was a bit dubious about this Mr.Z horse at first, I'm really relieved to see how good it looks being ridden -- that's precisely what I wanted it for (and no doubt what most 1/6 action figure collectors are looking for, as well).

Good luck with your plan for the 'triple brown' (pun intended ).

Despite the rather specific position -- technically a problem with any statue -- the Akhal-Teke does look great.

sorry men about my remark about jumping horses are for girls. In the begin of the seventies I bought a full 13 ft container of horse models straight from Breyer. At the time they cost peanuts, depending on the model ( all traditional ) $1,- to $ 3,-. I was selling all of the jumping styles to girls and ladies!
Most horse models are in proportions wrong. Like Breyer they make the widest size of the horse in the middle, however a top view will show the horse is a pear model, the last ribs ( like with us ) is the widest and so are the hips. There for the shafts on a cart or wagon are the widest in the hind and than they bent inwards to the front. I ordered for one Hannoverian model but I am concerned about the size of the width given. That size is only possible if all the models are females and in faul!. This is the reason I started to make my own models 20 years ago as I wanted to have better anatomic correct horses. I got the sizes from the book AN ATLAS OF ANIMAL ANATOMY FOR ARTISTS. The writer, prof. W. Ellenberger, ( arond 1900 ) used to freeze-in complete horses and than sliced them like a bread. He measred the parts and noted down with his students any thing he saw in that slice. For anyone intereted about real horse proportions you can still buy the book, for $ 15.- or € 15,- or ten pounds you will get it send free home. You will find 64 different sizes for all the parts of a horse and there are a number of tables in the publication about several breeds, most English. Meanwhile it seems for my 1/6 wagon models the best option is the thoroughbred horse but I see it has not been released yet. I liked the hair indication on the Hannoverian but that seems to have disappeared again from the Thoroughbred. Making and selling horse models is big business, the turnover world wide is at least $ 75,- million per year! The search for a perfect scale horse comes forward from the effort to make perfect scale vehicles. So if you have a perfect wagon or cart but the horse does not look well the whole impression is wrong. There are hundreds of scale drawings available for making miniature vehicles - most in the 1/8 scale. This has to do with the fact in old magazines for the Carriage Inustrie from 1850 onward a folded up scale drawing was added in the 1½ inch to 1 foot ( which is 1 : 8 ) scale. However if you buy a set in the 1/8 scale any print shop can blow it up for you to the 1/6 scale. Mind you a simple cart can take up 70 hours of work building from scratch but a Gipsy Caravan up to 1.000 hours!   frits.nl

Hi again, Frits!

Thanks for the information about all the studies on equine anatomy. I understand you are keen to make sure everything is accurate and 'to-scale', something we can all appreciate here on this forum. : )

I hope that the Thoroughbred will work out for you, and that maybe Mr.Z will put out additional models soon.

In case you maybe hadn't see his work before, there's also Nohuanda Equine Art who makes 1/6 scale horses:



https://www.flickr.com/photos/nohuanda/


Would you share some photos of your own model horse creations here? As well as your wagons and carriages? Would love to see!

And finally, just to clarify -- my comment about the 'girls' was due to the fact that this forum has many female members, myself included. So, perhaps it's not quite possible to generalise completely. ; )

Since these are essentially general discussions of sixth-scale horses from various brands and sources, I have merged the various threads together. Unless one is doing a review or presentation of a specific product exclusively, let's keep them in one place for ease of access.

Thanks for the link, Sky, those are some very impressive equine creations.

Juliana and Cinamon (Mr Z Ill horse)

Gorgeous beast, Delanie.

Lovely picture. The color of the horse nicely matches the color of Juliana's hair.

Skywalker thank you for your comment and the information on Nohuanda equine art horse models. beautiful scuptered and painted. With the grey model laid on its side you can see the pear model of the body I wrote about. This is really an artist who knows his business.
Would like to show pictures of my horse models from the past and some 1/6 vehicle miniatures I have built if I would know how to post pictures on this site.
Frits.nl

Frits.nl wrote:Would like to show pictures of my horse models from the past and some 1/6 vehicle miniatures I have built if I would know how to post pictures on this site.

If you are having problems posting images, take a look at this thread, it might help. Or if there is an error message, let us know.